Aquarian Weekly (NJ) - February 8, 1995
Type O Negative - "Be Careful What You Wish For"
Pete Steele & Josh Silver, Interviewed by Robert Makin
(taken without permission, but full credit given)
[my editing, comments, additions, whatever, enclosed in brackets]


Q: Comment on the recent concern about violence and injury in the
   moshpit.

PS: When you go out to have a good time, like playing football,
    racing cars, there's always an element of danger. Just
    because somebody gets hurt playing football doesn't mean
    you're going to ban football games. Kids go to a club to have
    fun. I think it should be known that if somebody gets hurt at
    a club, it's their own responsibility. It's not the club's
    fault. The club should not be liable unless there's some goon
    throwing kids off stage or some kind of hazardous condition
    exists. But otherwise, if a kid gets up onstage, jumps off and
    gets hurt, that's nobody's fault but his own.
       We live in a society where everything's a lawsuit. Everybody
    else is to blame except for the person who has the problem. I
    think that people should really start to take responsibility
    for their own actions.

Q: Do you think there is a problem between some venues and patrons 
   when it comes to moshing?
   
JS: There are some overzealous security guards who are a little too 
    sadistic and enthusiastic, but that's an individual problem, just 
    like there's overzealous patrons who go a little too berserk.

PS: You see a lot of fucked up stuff from the stage. You see security 
    whacking people, throwing kids down real hard. Now, of course, 
    that's something I don't go for. These security goons just don't 
    understand that they're kids. It's not that serious to them. 
    They're just there to have a good time. I don't know what the 
    solution is.

Q: What made you do a Carnivore reunion?

PS: Money, but primarily it's fun. I get to see the guys I haven't 
    played with in a while. I get to see some of the people who used 
    to go to Carnivore shows. It brings back good times.

Q: Does some of that same crowd come to see Type O?

PS: Very few.

Q: That surprises me, because the first two Type O albums were an 
   obvious evolution from hardcore. I would think that the crowd 
   would have evolved, too.

PS: Well the band has a lot of different influences, not just 
    hardcore. It's true that I have hardcore roots, but I was much
    younger and definitely a very different person when I was into
    that stuff.

Q: Is the hardcore scene dead? 

PS: I would say so. There are a few hardcore bands now that I like. 
    The band Shelter that we're playing with tonight really brings 
    me back to the old days, because they have a very 
    go-for-the-throat style, very unpretentious, very real, which 
    is what hardcore was about. There really aren't too many bands
    like that now.

Q: Type O got their start in the metal scene, yet you, among many
   other heavy alternative acts, have evolved away from that scene.
   Given that evolution, plus the recent cancellation of MTV's
   Headbanger's Ball and the closing of such clubs as L'amour, is 
   the metal scene also dead?

JS: The term is outdated. What is metal? What is alternative?
    Alternative is just everything that can't be or is hard to 
    classify. I think just the word metal is dead. There's bands 
    that are heavy and have hard edges, it doesn't mean they're 
    metal or not metal.

Q: Music seems to be harder and heavier than ever, yet it doesn't
   sound like metal.

JS: There's a lot more melody as opposed to five or six years ago.

Q: There's also a lot of vocal harmony, such as on Bloody Kisses.
   How much do you think that has to do with your burgeoning
   commercial breakthrough?

PS: A lot. People want to be able to hum a song after they listen
    to it. I've had people come up to me and say, 'You know, Pete, 
    I hate you and your band, but I can't get your fucking songs out
    of my head.' I'm like, 'Thank you very much.'
    
Q: How much do you think Q104.3 [NYC commercial heavy rock
   station, who in my opinion were instrumental in breaking 
   Type O through in the NYC area by overplaying 'Christian Woman' 
   ad nauseam] has affected your career?

PS: A lot. 

Q: Do you owe them a lot?

PS: Owe them? I don't know, because it's like tit-for-tat. We
    provide something that keeps them in business, and they're
    doing a service for us that keeps us in business. I don't think 
    we owe them anything except thanks.

Q: Comment on the fact that alternative radio stations, such as
   WHTG 106.3, have gotten a lot heavier. This time last year, WHTG
   weren't playing bands like you and Danzig, and now they are.

PS: We're a commodity now.

Q: Has there been a unification of punk and metal, not only in the 
   sound of the bands but in the presentation of them?

PS: Maybe people are getting a bit more open-minded that in the 
    past. I'm definitely finding that. I think it's a real good
    thing. There's not one pure type of music now. Everybody has so
    many different influences, and there's so much great music out
    there, that it's like trying to paint a painting with just one
    color. It gets really boring. You need a whole palette to work
    from.

Q: That's what Bloody Kisses is, a real diversification with 
   elements of gothic, industrial, punk, metal, pop. You have 
   worked really hard this past year. Roadrunner has worked hard 
   with you. Probably your next record will come out on Roadrunner, 
   but one day, do you see Type O Negative on a major label?

PS: Do you want to answer that, Josh?

JS: No, 'cause I'm scared of the answer.

PS: For me, I don't mind being on a small label, because I have a
    lot of control.I'm afraid if we get picked up by a larger label 
    and I start having tantrums, they'll just say drop dead, and put
    the band on the shelf. Right now, I can just walk up to the
    office and threaten somebody and get my way. If I were to go to
    Warner Brothers, they'll just have security come. Roadrunner
    doesn't have security.

Q: A lot of success has come your way. The perception is that
   you're an overnight success, but, of course, we know that's not
   true. In reality, your success, just like your debut album title,
   has come slow, deep and hard.

PS: I never thought of it like that, but it's very true.

Q: Compare that to bands such as Green Day or Candlebox who explode 
   from obscurity to overexposure.

JS: I think bands that come up that fast also go [down] that fast. 
    Bands that take a lot of time and build up their followings 
    -- fans who are going to stick with you through musical changes
    and grow with the band-- last over a period of years rather than
    on two radio singles. I think there's a lot less longevity with a
    band that burns that bright too fast.

PS: Everything is pretty much formulated. There's a business
    strategy involved. It's like war. It's the same thing. You lose,
    you lose everything.

Q: When the Pantera tour is done, you'll have been on the road 
   almost a year straight. Does that feel like a war sometimes?
   
JS: All the time.

PS: With each other, yeah. More than anything else, I'm at war with 
    myself, because I still don't know if I've made the right 
    decision yet by leaving my job and dedicating my life to the 
    band. But we'll see. Anybody who's ever made anything out of 
    themselves has always had to take a huge chance. Failure is 
    actually a really good thing if you learn from your errors. I 
    don't think I'm a stupid person. I learn from my mistakes.

Q: There's still plenty of opportunity at this point.

PS: Sure there is. There's lateral things that can be done as well. 
    We've had some other interest. I just wrote a song for a movie 
    called The Addiction. And there's movie interest, parts in 
    movies for us and things like that. So it leads to other things.

Q: You can't tell me you miss your day jobs.

PS: I do, yes, because I like routine. I like waking up at 
    4:30 a.m. I like being home from work at 2:30 p.m., so that I 
    have the whole rest of the day to do the things I like to do.
       Money to me represents independence. Once I make enough, I
    won't have to make anymore, and I can kiss the whole world
    goodbye.

Q: What kind of toll has being on the road taken on your psyche?

PS: I think we're all just hanging on by strings right now, trying 
    to be as patient and tolerant of each other as possible. We all 
    miss our friends at home, our families. Hopefully it will lead 
    to something better down the road. It's an investment. We suffer 
    now for some greater good.

JS: I just hope we don't all lost sight of the fact that we were
    friends way before this band ever existed and that before this
    much business got into it, it was a lot more fun.
    
PS: Definitely. When we all had day jobs and stuff, we did not have 
    to take the band seriously. But now, this is what we live off 
    of. If the band collapses, it's going to mean hardship for us. 
    It's a risk, and it's become a bit more stressful.

Q: Is it still fun?

JS: It has its moments.

PS: Yeah, when we're having a really good show or when there's funny 
    things going on.

JS: But when you have nothing, you have nothing to lose. You don't 
    care. Now it's our job. I gotta pay bills. I'm 32 years old. 
    I'm not a child. I don't live with my mother. It's a real
    concern unfortunately.

PS: It's a job, fulltime.

Q: But if you compare your job operating heavy machinery for the
   city parks department to doing the band fulltime, which is more
   like a job?

PS: The parks department because I had a routine. This is different. 
    They're both a job, but it's like comparing apples to oranges.

Q: Josh, compare your old job to the band.

JS: It was very similar, because it was a lot of music. I was 
    self-employed (running a recording studio) [note: Josh owns 
    Systems Two studios in Brooklyn, where all the Type O and Life 
    of Agony recordings were done] and had to always motivate 
    myself, just like a band. If you're not willing to really work 
    hard, you're not going to be shit. I did always want to take a 
    stab at this, but I gotta say, you gotta be careful for what 
    you wish for, because you might get it.

PS: And we do usually. We get exactly what we want.

Q: You've already started to write your next album. What is that
   like compared to your previous releases?

PS: Stuff like 'Black No. 1', 'Christian Woman.' Heavy, melodic.
    I think I'd like the next album to be a bit more psychedelic
    actually. But we'll see what happens.
       We had very different plans for this last album. It turned
    out radically different. Even though it didn't turn out like we
    expected it to, it turned out pretty well.
       Josh is really good in the studio. I tell him what I hear,
    and he's able to take those ideas and make them happen. So we're 
    a good team in the studio.

Q: It's great that the band is so self-contained and you don't
   need a lot of outside influences.

JS: Only the pharmacist.

PS: I have to give him a call too.

Q: I wasn't going to ask you any Prozac questions, but since you
   brought it up...

PS: I'm still on it.

Q: [to Josh] Are you on it too?

JS: Valium.

Q: It helps?

PS: I don't want to find out that it doesn't by stopping it.

JS: He's depressed. I'm hyperactive. We have a pill for every
    occasion.

Q: Yin and Yang (laughs). Do you have any idea when your next
   album might come out?

PS: When this album stops selling. When we have exhausted every
    trick in the book to get the public to buy Bloody Kisses. As
    long as the album keeps on selling, why not support it?

JS: The problem is that it was out for six months and we didn't
    do anything.

PS: I didn't know what the hell I wanted to do with my life,
    because I had a great day job. I really didn't want to tour.
    Ken (Kriete), the band's manager, asked me if I could take some
    time off of work to do a six-week U.S. tour. I said fine, that's
    cool. The tour was so successful, I figured this could work. It
    really showed me that the band had potential. I said to the band, 
    'I'm going to quit my job. Is everybody into this 100 percent?' 
    And they said yeah. I quit my job and that was it.

Q: Are you going to continue on past the Pantera tour?

PS: If the album still sells, yes, but I'm anxious to get back in
    the studio and make another album.

JS: We all are. We're sick of playing the same shit over and over.

PS: Even if it's an EP or a single. We like to be in the studio.
    We like to be home. We like to work like that, so the sooner 
    the better. But I'm sure after Pantera, there'll be some 
    festivals in Europe that we'll be asked to play.

Q: What is the best part of being this busy and what is the worst
   part?

JS: The best part, for me anyway, is achieving something that so
    few can do. So many try and so few succeed. I'm just happy with
    my one personal goals that I've set in my life.

PS: I think the best part is giving people pleasure with the music. 
    The worst part is not being able to see the people you love. 
    My parents are in their 70s. I'm horrified to call home
    everyday, because I'm afraid of what I'm going to hear or whom
    I'm not going to hear when I call home. So things happen from
    time to time and I have to go home to take care of them, so
    that's added stress on me.

Q: It's good to see you're so tight with your parents.

PS: I love my parents. They've always been behind the band, always 
    been behind me and Josh in local bands as kids. They never gave 
    me a hard time about having long hair or spending thousands of 
    dollars on basses and keyboards and all this other stuff, because 
    they figured I could be doing a lot worse. I could be out doing 
    drugs or some other shit, which we were never really into. We 
    were actually good kids. We never got into any trouble.

Q: You've earned this success by not only being a good band but good 
   people besides.

JS: I don't even think it's a matter of good, because I'm sure 
    there's plenty of pricks who are making tons of money in this 
    business. But I think it just takes a lot of dedication. I've
    been doing this for 19 years. Pete and I have been on the stage
    together 19 years.

Q: What was your first band?

PS: Aggression. We played in the lunch room of P.S. 193 on 
    Avenue L in Brooklyn, and I was hit with my first missile, which 
    was a half-eaten apple, right in the head. It was a kind of look 
    into the future for me.

Q: Comment on the irony of being tagged fascists by the European
   press, when Josh is Jewish.

JS: Well, there are Jewish fascists, but I'm not one of them.

PS: I think the basis for this was my band Carnivore. We had a
    symbol that some people said looked like a swastika. It was
    actually based on a radiation symbol, on three triangles,
    because there were three members in the band. It had nothing to 
    do with fascism or anything like that.
       During the course of an interview with the German press, I
    had said, trying to emulate that John Lennon comment about the
    Beatles being more popular than Christ, that at the present time
    I felt that Type O Negative was more popular than Adolf Hitler.
    I learned from that interview that when people don't have a
    complete grasp of the English language, they do not understand
    sarcasm. So now, when I do interviews with Europeans, I don't 
    try to be funny. If the ask me a question, I give them a direct
    answer that can not be misconstrued.

Q: So the misconception of the band as Nazis was the result of a
   language barrier?

JS: Partly, and I think it's a guilt problem. I think they feel real 
    guilty over there for World War II. They should stop inflicting 
    their guilt onto others and worry about what the important 
    issues are. They really have serious stuff going on over there. 
    If they have nothing better to do than bother with four assholes 
    from Brooklyn, then that's pretty sad.

PS: What's really sad and ironic is that they would use Nazi tactics 
    against us. They were calling us fascists, yet they were 
    protesting our shows, they were calling the club owners at home,
    threatening their lives, threatening the lives of their families,
    breaking windows, like Kristallnacht Part II. I thought it was
    hypocritical.

JS: It was. They had to use total propaganda to accomplish that. They 
    wrote [that] when we play in New York, we play with a swastika 
    behind us, we have white power guards lining the stage, and the 
    audience Sieg Hiels us. They made up a complete science fiction 
    story, just like Hitler did, and all these radical, so-called 
    liberal people became exactly what they were fighting against, 
    which is Nazis.

PS: But something wonderful came out of it. These people stirred up 
    so much controversy for the band that we sold thousands of 
    albums that we normally could not have sold, because they just
    generated so much curiosity about the band. They cut their own
    throats. So now I look forward to making comments to these
    people, because I know it will sell albums in the future.

Q: Another thing that ties into Josh being Jewish... do you ever get 
   sick of Pete's lyrics about Christianity?

JS: No, because growing up with Christians and going out with mostly 
    Christian women, just because that's the environment I'm in, I 
    have as many opinions about Christianity, [and] Catholicism as 
    any Catholic would. Probably more, because I'm a little further 
    back from the situation.
       I think it's a completely destructive institution. I think
    Judaism is too. I think Catholicism is worse, but it's shades of
    grey. Organized religion in general is a nightmare.

Q: I'm fascinated by the way your lyrics point out the negative and 
   destructive aspects of organized religion. It makes me curious as 
   to how you incorporate spirituality in your lives.

PS: I have no spirituality. I am completely rooted in science. I'm 
    200 pounds of walking meat. The idea of god to me is attempting 
    to put a face on physics that we have yet to understand. God, 
    to me, is a physics book.

JS: I completely agree, 100 percent. There was nothing before life,
    there is nothing after life. People have to answer all questions.
    People are terrified to say we just don't know, but we just don't.
    To make up a bizarre explanation that 80 percent of the planet
    believes is horrifying. They're just deluding themselves. They 
    have to have some form of denial in order to continue existence.

PS: Religion is just mass psychosis.

Q: But outside of religion, apart from a god, do you have any
   spirituality?

JS: The word spirituality has to be more clearly defined. It conjures 
    up images of supernatural things. I think my spirit is an 
    electro-magnetic field in my brain that makes up my personality.
    When my heart ceases to beat and no more oxygen reaches that 
    brain, that's the end of it. That doesn't mean I don't think I 
    have a soul so-to-speak. My soul is my personality, but it's not 
    magical or mystical or amazing. It's not going to float through 
    the universe forever after I'm dead. That's just my opinion.

Q: Why then does religion play a part in your lyrics?

PS: It's something that most people can relate to. It makes an 
    interesting topic to write songs about. I was raised Catholic. 
    I am no longer Catholic. I went to the Catholic school where I 
    had to deal with nuns and priests and all the bullshit that goes 
    with that.
       Christianity is just really hypocritical. More people have 
    died in the name of god than under any and all totalitarian
    regimes. It's ridiculous.

Q: Explain what inspired 'Christian Woman'

PS: Religious repression. The song is partially autobiographical.
    When I was growing up, sex was never discussed. Masturbation was
    never discussed. I had to repress sexual feelings, but, as you
    know, these feelings come out in many other ways. Some of the 
    ways they came out was through dreams. Basically, that's what the 
    song 'Christian Woman was about, but my life's really boring, so
    I'm not going to write a song about nocturnal emissions when I 
    was 13 years old, so I projected myself into this teenage girl, 
    who's so repressed. She goes to sleep looking at the cross every 
    night, and when she closes her eyes, her fingers do the walking.

Q: What subjects will your next album concern?

PS: The next album is more based on paganism. More songs about women, 
    of course.

Q: Isn't paganism a form of spirituality?

PS: Not the way I define it. I have the ultimate respect for nature. 
    I consider myself to be an evolutionist. I find beauty in all 
    things natural. My girlfriend and I like to go to the woods and
    look at leaves, almost like neo-hippies, getting into everything
    around us. That, to me, is paganism, respecting life. Everything
    has a right to live. In this band, we don't think that respect 
    has to be earned. We think that respect should be given, until 
    you realize that you're dealing with an asshole. Then you either 
    try to walk away or break their legs.
       Most ancient cultures-- Nordic, Native American, Orientals-- 
    all have the same beliefs. As we get further and further away from 
    our animal nature, we start to lose touch with the id and become
    species who think we're better than anything else because we 
    walk on two legs. For everything we create, we destroy 100 times.

JS: The planet will go on happily without us. I'm looking forward to 
    it. Some people say that's a really negative attitude. That's
    not negative, that's totally positive.

PS: It's nature's way.

JS: We'd be doing the planet a favor by getting rid of all the 
    people on earth. It knows what to do. It's doing the right 
    thing, and we can't stop it no matter how hard we try.

Q: Unless humankind changes its destructive ways.

JS: Yeah, can you imagine that? The common man changing his 
    viewpoint? One hundred percent of humanity cooperating to make 
    the world a better place? That's a great fairy tale, but it ain't 
    gonna happen, man. Sorry.

PS: People will not change, especially when the media dictates
    values. That's really scary to me.

JS: What's even scarier is when they allow it to happen. It's one 
    thing to be told what to do, it's another thing to be quiet and
    doing it.

Q: Like sheep.

JS: Exactly. Human nature is to destroy. If everyone was the same
    color, there'd be a new reason to kill each other.

PS: It would be, like, how a person smelled differently. There is
    always some reason to fight. My family comes from Brooklyn, 
    where there is Irish, Italian, German. All these people look the 
    same, but they fought every day, because they were from a 
    different part of Europe.

Q: While touring, have you encountered any culture, society that
   comes close to an ideal?

PS: It seems like Scandinavia has it really together.

JS: The reason I think is because they refuse to let anybody in.
    Everyone has the same beliefs and culture, and they will not 
    let you in. You can't go and live there if you wanted to.

PS: Everybody works, everybody contributes. That's what makes a
    society strong.

Q: If either of you were president of the United States, what would
   be your first course of action?

JS: I'd resign, because I don't want the job of herding ridiculous
    people to do what I consider to be the right thing. I want nature
    to take its course. I want man off this earth, and I don't have 
    to do a thing to accomplish my mission, except sit back and watch 
    it happen.

PS: I think I would send all the white people back to Europe, all
    the blacks to Africa, all the Orientals to Asia. I'd just leave 
    the country to the Native Americans and let them decide who's 
    allowed back in. Then I would leave.

Q: When Valentine's Day comes around, you'll be in Michigan with 
   a day off. What do you think you'll do?

JS: Masturbate.

PS: Probably playing a headlining show somewhere. We don't like
    days off.

JS: They're torture.

PS: If we don't play a headlining show, I would like to spend the
    day with a special lady.

Q: Who would be your first choice for a valentine and what would
   you do?

JS: I'm glad I don't have that choice.

PS: Every woman is beautiful. Every woman is like a flower in a
    junkyard to me. I don't know. I like to please women, so it's 
    not so much what I would do, it's what they want me to do to 
    them.



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Hope you all enjoyed it,

James Bako